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The technical section of the village pump is used to discuss technical issues about Wikipedia. Bug reports and feature requests should be made in Phabricator (see how to report a bug). Bugs with security implications should be reported differently (see how to report security bugs).

If you want to report a JavaScript error, please follow this guideline. Questions about MediaWiki in general should be posted at the MediaWiki support desk. Discussions are automatically archived after remaining inactive for five days.

Heading markup changes

The HTML used to render all headings is being changed to improve accessibility. It will change on 22 May in some skins (Timeless, Modern, CologneBlue, Nostalgia, and Monobook). Please test gadgets on your wiki on these skins and report any related problems so that they can be resolved before this change is made in all other skins. The developers are also considering the introduction of a Gadget API for adding buttons to section titles if that would be helpful to tool creators, and would appreciate any input you have on that.

MediaWiki message delivery 23:01, 20 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Based on a quick search, it looks like the heading change will affect almost 300 scripts, many of which have inactive maintainers. Some arbitrary highlights from the top of the list include:
Plus many, many more. --Ahecht (TALK
PAGE) 19:22, 21 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
A quick way to test these scripts right now, is to enable the Parsoid beta option (which already uses the new html structure) and to disable DiscussionTools, which uses a partial form of the new heading structure. —TheDJ (talk • contribs) 08:39, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed, you can already see it in Parsoid mode (but note that there are other differences – e.g. Parsoid output has <section> tags around each section, which may require a separate set of updates in some scripts).
Disabling DiscussionTools doesn't actually change anything though. The HTML structure is the same whether it's enabled or disabled, only the styles are different. Also, note that it uses a "hybrid" heading structure currently when using the default parser, as you say, but it uses the new structure when using Parsoid.
So in short, you can just use Parsoid mode to test these scripts today here on English Wikipedia, but beware that there may be extra issues. But if they work with Parsoid, they will work with the new headings too. Matma Rex talk 11:25, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The technical 13 script was blanked, so we don't have to worry about that one.
Will the fact that they're rolling this out for only some wikimedia-deployed skins at this time make the patch more complicated? If I'm reading it right, the scripts may temporarily have to support both heading styles. –Novem Linguae (talk) 09:16, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, it does, and they have to. Matma Rex talk 11:20, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
At a glance, it seems that User:Mr. Stradivarius/gadgets/SignpostTagger.js already supports the new style, as it uses $( '#bodyContent h2:first' ).text() as a backup if $( '#bodyContent h2:first span.mw-headline' ) doesn't exist (line 291). — Mr. Stradivarius ♪ talk ♪ 13:09, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Fixed RFUD-helper. Thanks for the ping. – SD0001 (talk) 18:33, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This is going to break both my edit request scripts, I will try to fix them at the weekend. Terasail[✉️] 18:41, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've fixed my fork of the OneClickArchiver script (though now it only works with the new format; I don't care enough to get it working with both). Elli (talk | contribs) 02:09, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And copy-section-link too (same caveat). Elli (talk | contribs) 02:16, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Another one: User:Σ/Testing_facility/Archiver.js. Izno (talk) 00:45, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And a couple other gadgets still remaining:
Izno (talk) 00:51, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Gadget-teahouse is no longer used now that DiscussionTools has been rolled out. Pinging @Prtksxna and @TheDJ for the other two. --Ahecht (TALK
PAGE) 15:54, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Σ's Archiver script has been superseded by forks. See subsection just below: #Tech News – User:Enterprisey/archiver.js. —⁠andrybak (talk) 01:19, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I had no idea that one had gotten forked. Izno (talk) 01:24, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Gadget-autonum (Auto-number headings)

I'm assuming ~ and feel free to correct me if i'm wrong ~ that something about this deployment is why headings no longer have numbers (for me)? Will it be possible to go back to that at some point? I find long pages almost impossible to navigate around without numbered headings, so will have to learn a new way of working if it won't be possible. Thanks, Happy days, ~ LindsayHello 16:24, 27 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@LindsayH: No, that was removed a while ago. You may try the "Auto-number headings" gadget here. Nardog (talk) 19:31, 27 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If you're speaking about the table of contents, Vector 22 does not provide numbering. Vector, Monobook, and Modern do.
If you are speaking about each actual heading, then indeed the preference is gone and indeed there is a gadget for it now. You have correctly identified that gadget as needing to be updated for this change. It looks like the necessary change to the snippet (documentation) has already been made, so someone needs to port that here. Izno (talk) 19:59, 27 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, Izno, helpful. I'd assumed it was a script/gadget, as so many appeared to be affected above. I shall patiently wait in hope Happy days, ~ LindsayHello 11:51, 28 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@LindsayH. I think I fixed this gadget for monobook/timeless/modern with this update. But there is still a double number bug on some talk pages on vector/vector-2022. Will work on that next. –Novem Linguae (talk) 16:50, 1 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You star! Thanks for the notification (and, of course, for fixing it). Happy days, ~ LindsayHello 06:14, 2 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Tech News – User:Enterprisey/archiver.js

I've been testing my fork of Enterprisey's script – User:Andrybak/Archiver. Example edits: 1226884323, 1227442551, 1227443165, 1227444165. So far, the script doesn't seem to be affected. —⁠andrybak (talk) 19:21, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

✅ Another successful test with random things (including cases, which were mentioned in bug reports): Special:Diff/1227451320. —⁠andrybak (talk) 21:33, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Did you try all the old skins such as Timeless and Monobook? Vector isn't affected at all yet, and editing likely uses the API, but I can imagine the location of the header links this script places being possibly broken in old scripts. I fixed this kind of thing in 2 gadgets so far. –Novem Linguae (talk) 22:15, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I know that Σ's User:Σ/Testing facility/Archiver supported at least Timeless: User talk:Σ/Archive/2021/January#Archy McArchface button caption in Timeless, so I expect Enterprisey's version to have remained compatible with other skins.
Good shout.  Checking... —⁠andrybak (talk) 22:28, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Facepalm Facepalm argh, I didn't read past the first sentence. My bad. Thank you, Novem Linguae, for pointing it out. —⁠andrybak (talk) 22:44, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Novem Linguae, support for MonoBook and Timeless has been added: Special:Diff/1227543602. —⁠andrybak (talk) 11:22, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Tests on real discussions: MonoBook, Timeless, Vector 2010, Vector 2022. —⁠andrybak (talk) 11:47, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

New h2 headings use serif font even when the "Vector classic typography" gadget is enabled

Vector classic typography is a gadget that forces all text to use sans-serif fonts, but even with the gadget enabled h2 headings on articles use a serif font. Incorrect behavior seen on both Firefox and Edge. TomatoFriesLAN (talk) 18:51, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@TomatoFriesLAN Thanks for reporting, this is caused by the heading changes announced two weeks ago, which were deployed to legacy Vector as well this week. This edit should fix it: [1] – please try now. Matma Rex talk 20:27, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Works, good job. TomatoFriesLAN (talk) 03:53, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

XFDcloser

I usually spend part of the day closing AFD discussions but none of the XFDcloser options are showing up. Not even the ability to relist. I've uninstalled every installation, unchecked the XFDcloser gadget, returned everything to normal but nothing works. Do I have to reboot my computer or something? Log out and log back in? This rarely happens so I'm not sure what happened today. I've posted a message on the XFDCloser talk page but it doesn't get much activity there. Liz Read! Talk! 23:26, 6 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's not an XFDC issue, it's a THURSDAY issue. Primefac (talk) 00:35, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Izno, I see you've moved this section, and it does appear to be mentioned in the original post of this threading, but why would it only appear now? I seem to recall closing discussions earlier this week (and I suspect Liz has as well). Primefac (talk) 01:17, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I mean, it could not be this, and you're welcome to move it back, it just has the smell. Izno (talk) 01:24, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I patched xfdcloser a couple days ago, so a new bug today is probably something else. Will take a look. –Novem Linguae (talk) 02:52, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, I thought this thread was deleted until I found it reposted up here.
It's odd because XFDCloser was working fine this morning and then this afternoon, it just didn't load at all. But I see other editors closing discussions so I hope it isn't just me. I've had ongoing problems with XFDCloser not loading on CFD pages but it hasn't been a problem on AFD daily logs until today. Thanks for checking Novem Linguae, there are usually over 100 AFD discussions daily so if this is happening for other closers, they could pile up pretty quickly. If it matters, I use a laptop with Windows. Liz Read! Talk! 03:17, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's still working in Vector 2022, so changing your preferences temporarily is a workaround. Hopefully the issue will be fixed soon. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 03:39, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I figured out the cause. I should have a fix deployed soon.
For the record, it looks like WMF deployed mw:Heading HTML changes to old skins (monobook, timeless, modern, cologneblue) last week, vector (2010) this week, and probably minerva and vector-2022 in the coming weeks. All breakages we see today will probably be vector (2010) only.
This staggered deployment has pros and cons. It means that if someone like me does fix a bunch of gadgets today, I'll just have to go fix them all again next week when they break on vector-2022.
It would be nice if there were an API for inserting header links. phab:T337286. APIs like mw.util.addPortlet(), mw.util.addPortletLink(), etc are great for multi-skin support and for keeping HTML changes from breaking gadgets and user scripts. –Novem Linguae (talk) 05:43, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, I don't understand all of this jargon but I am FOREVER grateful that their are editors who do. Thanks for looking into this. Liz Read! Talk! 06:33, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Fix deployed for XFDcloser. Should be fixed within the next 15 minutes (gadget code is cached for up to 15 minutes). –Novem Linguae (talk) 06:35, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I see I did use Vector Legacy 2010. I don't like for page formatting and white space of the updated Vector 2022. Liz Read! Talk! 06:37, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I also use Vector 2010. Best skin :) –Novem Linguae (talk) 06:38, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I am looking forward to Vector 2034 — GhostInTheMachine talk to me 06:51, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, and I don't like the left-side menu. But thanks Novem Linguae, it looks like things are now back to normal. I can go back to my old skin! Many thanks. Liz Read! Talk! 07:24, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Novem Linguae, XFDCloser disappeared again! I think you said this might happen. It came back when I changed to Vector 2022 but, ugh! I guess I'll use that skin when working in AFDLand and then change back when doing regular editing. Liz Read! Talk! 22:15, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm trying out Timeless. It's not as bad as Vector 2022. Liz Read! Talk! 22:32, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
But it doesn't work with Twinkle. Liz Read! Talk! 01:53, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, XFDcloser returned to operational status. Thanks to whomever fixed that. Liz Read! Talk! 03:13, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Very strange. I haven't done any work on XFDcloser since the last deploy on Thursday, and I don't see any relevant backport patches at wikitech:Server Admin Log that might have changed MediaWiki behavior this weekend. This is all quite mysterious. –Novem Linguae (talk) 08:56, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Novem Linguae, it's just happened again, over the span of the past hour! This is getting annoying to have to keep changing skins. Liz Read! Talk! 23:31, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Liz. I deployed a fix related to the beta version of XFDcloser. Can you try Vector again and let me know if things are fixed? –Novem Linguae (talk) 00:48, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

User script that puts a ¶ symbol next to headings

What's the user script or gadget that puts a ¶ symbol next to headings, and when you click on it, it opens a modal with links to that section that you can copy/paste? It broke for me today and I want to fix it, but can't remember what it's called. Thanks. –Novem Linguae (talk) 03:35, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Is it User:Enterprisey/copy-section-link? Sounds like what you described, but I don't see where you have it imported. – 2804:F14:809B:2701:19B4:583A:7C56:999F (talk) 04:22, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ah, it's in my global.js. No wonder I couldn't find it. Thank you very much for this link. –Novem Linguae (talk) 06:37, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I wrote a script that provides links to user comments as well as headings, which I updated to support both the new and legacy methods of marking up headings. Its interface is a bit different though from the copy-section-link script. isaacl (talk) 06:23, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I can't find where the script is putting the link(s) on Vector 2010. Any hints? –Novem Linguae (talk) 07:04, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The function showCommentLinks() (starting on line 73) adds the links. The section of code starting at line 84 finds headings in the HTML document structure previously generated by MediaWiki (which I believe is the same across skins). The section of code starting at line 93 finds headings in the currently generated HTML document structure. isaacl (talk) 15:27, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I was hoping you'd just tell me where the links are. lol. Anyway, I put a breakpoint on line 75 and the breakpoint is not getting hit when I refresh this page. I'm missing something. –Novem Linguae (talk) 20:33, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were asking about the interface. As described in the documentation, you have to select the "Toggle link2clipboard" item in the tools menu (the location of the menu depends on your skin; for Vector 2010 it's in the left sidebar). </> is prepended to the start of each comment. For headings, <h/> is also prepended. Most of the time I don't want to see the links, so I chose to require an extra step to display them. Another difference from the other script is that for the major non-Safari browsers, the link text is automatically copied to the clipboard (always without surrounding square brackets; the other script can be configured not to do that if desired). isaacl (talk) 20:51, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nice, that worked. Thanks a lot. Feature idea: Add a way to copy it as an external link. I do this a lot when writing GitHub or Phabricator tickets, for example. –Novem Linguae (talk) 20:59, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
As my personal frequent use case is to link to comments or sections in wikitext, I wanted a way that would provide easy access to the link without underscores ;-) (And I chose to avoid square brackets as it's easier to add them when needed than delete them, and I like to use {{section link}} when feasible.) I'll take it under consideration, though; thanks for the feedback! isaacl (talk) 21:08, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Section header typeface

I just noticed that section headers in articles are now using a serif typeface on both Vector and Vector legacy. Sorry I couldn't find information about this elsewhere but when and why was this change made? I do not like that it uses Oldstyle figures and would like to change it in my settings or .css page to be the same sans serif font used in other headers. Thanks! Reywas92Talk 17:23, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Reywas92 Vector headers have actually been using serif fonts by default for a long time, but you have user CSS which was overriding that. It no longer works due to some changes to heading HTML. You can either change that part of your user CSS to:
h1, h2, .mw-heading1, .mw-heading2 {
    font-family: inherit !important;
}
Or alternatively just use the gadget "Vector classic typography" which has already been fixed. the wub "?!" 19:25, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! Forgot they did that a decade ago, these numerals are awful. Reywas92Talk 20:23, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

One click archiving not working?

I have been using User:Evad37/OneClickArchiver for some time, but I noticed the other day that the archiving links are no longer appearing for me. Anyone know why that might be? Just Step Sideways from this world ..... today 18:06, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Just Step Sideways, see § Heading markup changes. I believe User:Andrybak/Archiver is a working fork. — Qwerfjkltalk 18:08, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the pointer! I guess I'm off to install that. Just Step Sideways from this world ..... today 18:13, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, that works, but it certainly isn't "one-click". Oh well. Just Step Sideways from this world ..... today 18:17, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Just Step Sideways and Qwerfjkl, there are two kinds of scripts, which make semi-automatic archiving easier. Page Wikipedia:One click archiving lists User:Evad37/OneClickArchiver as the most recent script for "One click archiving". My User:Andrybak/Archiver is the latest for "Multi-section archiving". —⁠andrybak (talk) 18:28, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't mean to disparaige your script,it works just fine, while currently, the Evad one does not. Just Step Sideways from this world ..... today 18:44, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No disparagement taken. From Qwerfjkl's reply it might seem like User:andrybak/Archiver is a fork of User:Evad37/OneClickArchiver, but it's not. I just wanted to ensure there's no confusion about that. —⁠andrybak (talk) 18:49, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Apologies, my mistake. — Qwerfjkltalk 19:30, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It looks like Elli and FlightTime have recently worked on their copies of OCA. Are yours functioning in the new structure? Izno (talk) 21:00, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yep, mine works :) Elli (talk | contribs) 21:05, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Elli, please consider adding your script to Wikipedia:One click archiving and Wikipedia:User scripts/List#Discussions 3. —⁠andrybak (talk) 21:57, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've now done so. Elli (talk | contribs) 22:07, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Just Step Sideways ^ Izno (talk) 22:06, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nice, just installed it works great. Thanks all. Just Step Sideways from this world ..... today 17:19, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Neat! I came to VPT just to browse, and not even 10 sections in, I learned of a script that deals with the new header markup. Rusty4321 talk contribs 01:34, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

OneClickArchiver disappeared...Answers found here

Very handy gadget for manual-archiving - User:Evad37/OneClickArchiver.js - but it isn't showing up today on any talk pages for me. Don't know why, the script is still sitting on my common.js page. Has it been disabled/usurped by a better gadget? Why isn't it showing up?... Help please & thanks, Shearonink (talk) 14:48, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ok so after posting the above query I have now read through some of the other threads about archiver scripts... Is there a present script or fork that works on individual sections/posts/threads like Evad37's used to do? Shearonink (talk) 14:54, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Forgot to add...I am editing with Vector 2010 original/legacy if that make a difference. Shearonink (talk) 14:57, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

For anyone who is as much of a non-adept at code & tech stuff around here and has Evad37's one-click oneclick one click archive script installed, and wants the same functionality, do the following:

Broken template in Vector 2010

It would appear that these recent changes have broken Evad37's WP:Highlight duplicate links script in Vector 2010, which now no longer distinguishes between repeated links in the lead section and repeated links in the article body. ‑‑Neveselbert (talk · contribs · email) 18:20, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Script works for me. What kind of skin are you using ? —TheDJ (talk • contribs) 18:41, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh lol, it was in the title :) Anyway. works with vector 2010 for me. —TheDJ (talk • contribs) 18:42, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This seems unrelated. Should be moved out to its own section. Nothing has changed in Vector 2010 skin. 🐸 Jdlrobson (talk) 20:01, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@TheDJ and Jdlrobson: On Elizabeth II, using Vector 2010, the script highlights links in the lead section which shouldn't be highlighted, as they're not repeated in the lead section, and highlights links (in red) that are the first instances of those links in the article body. This does not occur in Vector 2022. ‑‑Neveselbert (talk · contribs · email) 22:49, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This is indeed caused by mw:Heading HTML changes. I think this needs to be fixed in User:Evad37/duplinks-alt.js. It should be sufficient to replace this line: 
if (this.nodeName.toLowerCase() == 'h2') {
with this: 
if ( $(this).is('h2, .mw-heading2') ) {
(cc @Evad37) Matma Rex talk 08:46, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Gadget for unsupported titles

Would people be open to deploying a gadget similar to wikt:MediaWiki:Gadget-UnsupportedTitles.js on the English Wikipedia? The code there is somewhat specific to Wiktionary, but the idea is that pages like https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/:%7C get JavaScript redirected to pages describing the characters in question, and it also uses JavaScript to fix the H1. I personally care less about the second issue than the first one, and would like to enhance it further so things like Building#19 get redirected to Building No. 19 rather than a nonexistent anchor in building. That part could be done using a template gadget that only loads on pages transcluding {{technical reasons}}. Not sure if the first part is feasible that way yet. * Pppery * it has begun... 04:10, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I pretty strongly believe that page titles should display the page title as accessible by the URL, regardless of whether that's the best title. Izno (talk) 06:27, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's not what's proposed. Pppery clearly say they "personally care less about" ... "us[ing] JavaScript to fix the H1". – SD0001 (talk) 07:20, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If it's what e.g. isaacl came to, then I do probably still oppose implementation - fighting with MediaWiki over just how to navigate to a page sounds like a pure lose lose situation. Izno (talk) 15:54, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's a "pure lose lose" situation that readers get to read about Building #19 when they search for Building #19? Don't overuse hyperbole – it spoils its impact when actually needed. – SD0001 (talk) 17:03, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, I'm not being hyperbolic. Please don't be a dick. I sincerely don't think there's a win to "let's fuck around with anchors". Izno (talk) 23:24, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
mediawiki.action.view.redirect.js – MediaWiki has for decades, to use your language, fucked around with anchors (to resolve sections links on redirected pages). You not thinking it's a win does not mean it's suddenly considered a bad practise. – SD0001 (talk) 15:37, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Not sure if the first part is feasible that way yet. It won't be feasible with a template gadget, but it would have been if phab:T241524 had been implemented instead, as you could inject the parser tag into the noarticletext interface message. – SD0001 (talk) 07:25, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Did you mean MediaWiki:Badtitletext? I don't see how you could end up at noarticletext instead - it's been standard practice for longer than I've been editing to create redirects like Gunnin' for That -> Gunnin' for That No. 1 Spot where the title would otherwise be red. * Pppery * it has begun... 14:48, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah that one. – SD0001 (talk) 15:20, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We probably can add logic to MediaWiki:Badtitletext to at least show a "did you mean" for that case, though. * Pppery * it has begun... 15:22, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've done that for now. Still think a gadget would be nice there, though, but it's probably not practical. * Pppery * it has begun... 17:31, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Wait a minute, turns out I'm wrong. Putting the interface message in the category does have the desired effect, even though it doesn't (obviously) cause pages using the message to show up in the category. – SD0001 (talk) 20:41, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think we should do this as a default gadget. — xaosflux Talk 09:44, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that work along these lines would be better implemented as a core feature rather than a gadget. I also don't like trying to redefine how URLs with fragment IDs work. It makes the behaviour non-standard and so the advantage of readers leveraging their experiences with the rest of the web is diminished. isaacl (talk) 15:34, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's a common pattern for fragment ids to redefine page content. SPAs wouldn't be possible without that. – SD0001 (talk) 17:03, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
(SPA = single-page application). * Pppery * it has begun... 17:31, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And the goal of Wikipedia is to educate people about the topic they are looking for, not preach about unrelated topics like how web apps work. * Pppery * it has begun... 17:31, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Didn't say anything about preaching. Just saying that following common web patterns means people know what to expect. A web page-based app uses a fragment ID to access a subresource of the page, as intended. Redefining the syntax to redirect to a completely different page is a different model. Sure, it can be done, but it's something unexpected. isaacl (talk) 00:49, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And my point is that fact is irrelevant in almost all contexts, and it's unnecessary preaching to convey that point instead of taking people where they clearly want to be taken. But whatever, it's clear that, for reasons that make no sense to me, this is being shot down and we're instead choosing to deliberately get in people's way. * Pppery * it has begun... 01:03, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The majority of readers reach Wikipedia via search engines. Making it easier for search engines to know the right index phrases for an article will help readers the most, as most of them pay little attention to the characters in the URL. (For those that do, personally I'd rather not defy their expectations by showing a page with a title that differs from what appears before the URL fragment ID.) isaacl (talk) 01:40, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't really like this idea. What good is having the page under an invalid title if you can't link to it (except as an external link)? All kinds of other interfaces also won't work or will display a different title as a result (e.g. what links here, watchlist, page view counts…). Matma Rex talk 20:56, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with Matma Rex. This kind of reminds me of phab:T315893 and phab:T338151, which I am also disinclined to support. We should keep all the various systems (what links here, watchlist, page view counts, wikilinks, how the title displays when loading the page) in sync with each other, and try to avoid adding more complexity than what we already have (the redirect system, CirrusSearch accepting case insensitivity, unnecessary space character in mobile talk page titles, etc.). By continuing to pile on complexity to the title system, I see a lot of potential for technical debt here. Debugging becomes difficult as the system gets so complex that few can wrap their head around the entire thing. –Novem Linguae (talk) 21:48, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Appearance dropbox menu

I have just noticed a new icon and associated dropdown menu "Appearance" just to the right of my user page link.(pair of spectacles?) It gives radiobox options for small, standard and large text. I like the idea, but it does nor work as I would expect. The selections change text size for existing article text and preview windows but edit window text size is unchanged by the selection. I assume this is a new feature, which I welcome, but the text size in the edit window is the one I really need to make bigger. Cheers, · · · Peter Southwood (talk): 15:00, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The new text-size selector is geared around "Accessibility for Reading", feedback is welcome at mw:Reading/Web/Accessibility for reading/Updates/2024-06 deployments's talk page. You may also try to file a feature request under phab:T313828 to request something like "use the Accessibility for Reading font size selection for editing as well". — xaosflux Talk 15:12, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the feedback @Pbsouthwood! Could I ask which editor you're using? Currently, we have the Visual Editor keeping the same size as the text, and the wikitext editor keeping the smaller size. If you're using the wikitext editor, I'd be curious if you could tell me a bit more about why the wikitext editor would work better at this size for you? We're currently collecting feedback on the feature that we hope to use for future changes and configurations. OVasileva (WMF) (talk) 15:25, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Describing my experience: right now I'm using the page zoom feature to make the all text sizes a bit bigger, both when reading and editing. If I reset this to 100% and use the accessibility for reading feature, then I can read with a larger font but would be editing (and previewing) with a smaller one. I'd have to increase the page zoom level anyway, and turn it back down when reading pages. So I'd rather just set page zoom once, as it will apply for all pages. isaacl (talk) 15:42, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I always use the wikitext editor. Partly habit, partly to maintain my skills and partly because I get frustrated when visual editor doesn't do what I want. No doubt it is great for some things, but so far I have not found out what. My eyes are deteriorating and get tired quickly, so editing on a larger font helps a lot. I generally zoom in the whole page to see what I have just typed and make corrections. It is easier on desktop where I have a mouse at hand. On laptop I have no mouse because of no suitable surface for it most of the time so zoom in and out with touchpad. Before the tablet failed I would zoom with two fingers there as well. It would be nice to have the edit screen follow the others. Might also be nice to have a fourth font size option, even larger. Some eyes are worse than others, and more accessibility is better. Cheers · · · Peter Southwood (talk): 16:06, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
To be clear, for proofreading the wikitext I need bigger text to spot the errors. I can read the smaller text but spotting the errors needs better resolution for reduced eyestrain. Cheers · · · Peter Southwood (talk): 16:51, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think the table of contents and all other text should also be enlarged in proportion. We also want to encourage editing. · · · Peter Southwood (talk): 06:34, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I asked over at Mediawiki, but is there a reason why the Special space is excluded from the Appearance menu? —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 23:45, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Just wanted to note that Olga has answered there. In short, this is about scannability and information density on pages that don't include long-from text. I'm not sure but perhaps we should move the discussion about font size on special pages on MediaWikiwiki? People from other wikis could chime in. SGrabarczuk (WMF) (talk) 22:53, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Perhaps it should also be about legibility in general, and accessibility for visually impaired users, unless there is a technical issue making it too difficult, or you have plausible reason to believe it would be unwanted by enough users to make it a problem. Cheers, · · · Peter Southwood (talk): 07:15, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I understood the version in permalink/1228796863, or you have plausible reason to believe it would not be wanted by enough users to make it a problem., but or you have plausible reason to believe it would be unwanted by enough users to make it a problem. says something very different and I'm having trouble making sense of it in context. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz Username:Chatul (talk) 11:23, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry to confuse. What I wanted to convey is that it does not really matter if a fair number of people fail to find it desirable, but it could be problematic if there are enough people who actively do not want it, which is the revised meaning. Wikipedia does have a history of people objecting strongly to things they feel have been pushed onto them without due process. Cheers, · · · Peter Southwood (talk): · · · Peter Southwood (talk): 13:32, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm starting to revert back to the old skin. The new skin's look feels awful, especially the infobox. I do not like the Infobox on the new Vector 2022 skin because it looks kinda like the mobile one, even the hatnotes. (EDIT: I reverted back to the Vector 2010 skin everytime I log in only.) ScarletViolet (talk • contribs) 13:39, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Toolforge problems

There is a problem which is causing widespread failures in toolforge and cloud-vps. I would expect that many tools and bots will be affected, so if you see something broken, thats probably what's going on. I'm afraid I don't have any more details. RoySmith (talk) 15:28, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Link above claims it is now resolved· · · Peter Southwood (talk): 16:29, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
FYI - @Peter Southwood, and @RoySmith the message of the outage is listed above the "solved" message and timestamped after the solved message. For example, Quarry tool is still failing. Regards, JoeNMLC (talk) 19:07, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Quarry error - access denied

Resolved
 – Fixed in external tool. — xaosflux Talk 15:08, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

For query here, getting this error message:

Access denied for user 'quarry'@'172.16.2.72' (using password: NO)

So far, I have tried these steps & always same error.

  1. Logged out, then back in.
  2. Tried Fork, then Submit.
  3. Logged out of Wikipedia. Logged in at quarry.wmcloud.org

Regards, JoeNMLC (talk) 00:33, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Update - Today at Quarry, the list of "Recent Queries" show them all as Failed for the last 24 hours or so. Once more, asking for help fixing this issue. Thanks. JoeNMLC (talk) 13:26, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The English Wikipedia volunteers can't do anything about Quarry, however you can report bugs about quarry here. — xaosflux Talk 14:34, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note, the "access denied" bug appears to already be open as phab:T365374. — xaosflux Talk 14:35, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks @Xaosflux for the quick response. Good to know that issue is being addressed. Going forward I saved above info. in my (offline) notepad Query file. Thanks again. Regards, JoeNMLC (talk) 14:48, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
FYI: the "access denied" bug is now resolved. — xaosflux Talk 15:07, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Minor template issue

Hi all, I'm noticing an issue with {{Cite Cambridge History of China}}. If I do {{Cite Cambridge History of China|volume=1}} it links to the wrong volume (volume 6 instead of 1):

Twitchett, Dennis; Loewe, Michael, eds. (1986). The Cambridge History of China, Volume 1: The Ch'in and Han Empires, 221 BC–AD 220. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press. ISBN 978-0-521-24327-8..

It should be linking here: [2]

Any help would be appreciated—I'm not exactly sure how/where in the code the google links are generated. Aza24 (talk) 01:07, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Aza24: I think I managed to fix it here: Special:Diff/1228582015. DanCherek (talk) 01:17, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Awesome, thank you. I was only looking at the doc subpage for some reason! Aza24 (talk) 01:18, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved
–Novem Linguae (talk) 06:52, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not loggin

Hi! Before when I was trying to put a reply in Phillip Jeong there's was a thing that said I wasn't logged in. I was loggin. Ned1a Wanna talk? 15:07, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There are lots of reasons that could happen, refreshing the page will normally resolve it or prompt you to log in again. — xaosflux Talk 15:07, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

EARWIG seems to be down atm

[3] I thought I should mention it. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:56, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Bugs with that external tool can be reported here or possibly with the developer here: User talk:The Earwig — xaosflux Talk 13:53, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, it's up again. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 15:33, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Disable edit summary warnings on redirect AES

So, I've enabled the warning on a blank edit summary and, while it has helped me a lot, it's also really annoying in one specific case. When I want to make a redirect, the H:AES is more than enough since it perfectly describes what the edit is. If people want to know the motivation behind the redirect's creation, they can look at the WP:RCATS I've provided. So, in that case, I'm forced to click Publish twice so the edit goes through, even though I know that it is going to have an edit summary and one that I'm perfectly happy with. I wish there were a way to disable the warning when an automatic summary is generated in the case of redirect creation(obviously excepting the default undo summary which should still generate a warning). To be clear, I'm not asking to change how the setting works for everyone. I'm asking for a way to toggle it between the current behavior and the one I described above. Nickps (talk) 11:33, 13 June 2024 (UTC) After reading m:Help:Edit_summary#Automatic_summaries, I changed my request to only apply to redirect creation Nickps (talk) 11:38, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"Prompt me when entering a blank edit summary (or the default undo summary)" is a software feature, not a community gadget, to request changes to its behavior you may file a feature request at phabricator. — xaosflux Talk 13:55, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I wanted to see if there was interest first. Will do. Nickps (talk) 13:56, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Done. Nickps (talk) 14:11, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not sure that AES is always the only thing needed when creating a redirect, yes it is useful but it only tells "what" was done, not "why" it was done, which is part of the usefulness of edit summaries. — xaosflux Talk 14:15, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For example, we often tag or categorize our redirects with more information, like "redirect from misspelling", etc -- and not everyone would know about that, but if they say so in their edit summary, others can figure out their intent. — xaosflux Talk 14:17, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't disagree with that, but, since most redirects are created for obvious reasons, I still think it should be left to the editor's discretion whether to rely on AES or not (that's why I'm asking for a second toggle instead of a change in the default behavior). I don't leave a custom summary on most redirects I make, and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. In the very rare case I think the redirect is needs an explanation, I will write a custom summary. In any case, the warning mostly gets in the way when I make redirects. Nickps (talk) 15:12, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thursday 13 June style changes

Infobox problems

I am not seeing infobox borders anymore (at Walter Cronkite and Google for example). Is that a "me" issue, or is something broken? (I am on Debian/Firefox, so it might very well be a "me"/specific issue.)

On Android (both app and Firefox) everything seems normal. JackTheSecond (talk) 19:08, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Same here. Also, my search box now disappeared! Martinevans123 (talk) 19:13, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
In My Preferences, Vector legacy (2010) restores my search box, Vector (2022) removes it. Perhaps coincidental/ unrelated. Martinevans123 (talk) 20:44, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Consider starting a new section for that. I have no idea what could be causing it. Izno (talk) 20:51, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Done Have started a new thread. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:10, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The infoboxes look different for me as well, starting recently. But I'm not sure it's a technical problem, it could be a recently released change? Simeon (talk) 19:14, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have the same thing. On further investigation, it only affects me on Vector 2022 and not on any other skins. If it's a change to the skin, it's also broken some images in infoboxes and sidebars. The images seem to have either shrunk considerably at their default size, stopped loading or completely disappeared. Examples include: Next Senedd election, 2024 United States presidential election, Template:Donald Trump series, Template:Joe Biden series, Template:Keir Starmer sidebar, Template: Rishi Sunak sidebar, Template:Elon Musk series, etc. I remember a similar change to infoboxes was made a few months ago but dropped within a day or two. Can anyone at Wikimedia provide some clarification? ThatRandomGuy1 (talk) 19:16, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Images are the same cause. I'll file a separate task for them since it's not obvious to me what the best resolution is for them. Izno (talk) 20:07, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, this one was caused by phab:T113101 and I've filed phab:T367463 for resolution. Izno (talk) 20:23, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
On Monobook, I'm finding that certain infobox images are showing smaller than usual. Images in {{Infobox station}}, for example, are appearing at 272px for me rather than the 340px that I normally see that at. I assume this is related to this issue? Pi.1415926535 (talk) 03:03, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Pi.1415926535, please see subsection #Infobox thumbnail-sized images are a few pixels too small. —⁠andrybak (talk) 09:40, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Andrybak: I'm not sure if the issue I'm seeing is that - I'm on Monobook rather than Vector, and I'm seeing them at ~80% size rather than just a few percent smaller. Regardless, hopefully it'll be sorted out by one of these Phabricator threads. Pi.1415926535 (talk) 20:16, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For disappearing images in {{ombox}}, subsection #Ombox images sometimes not showing has been created below. —⁠andrybak (talk) 09:40, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Same here on Firefox/Windows11. Don't remember seeing any discussion about this change anywhere before now. --JackFromWisconsin (talk | contribs) 19:23, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's affecting me on Windows 10 as well. ThatRandomGuy1 (talk) 19:26, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This happened yesterday on commons with Wikidata Infobox when using Vector-22 so it seems to be a Wikimedia change. Cakelot1 ☞️ talk 19:33, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Did looking around and the infoboxes now look like they do on the Minerva skin, and the hatnotes on the top of the article also look like Minerva now. Not sure if this is intentional or not. --JackFromWisconsin (talk | contribs) 19:40, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not surprised this happened, I will poke the relevant task. And yes, the relevant task also caused the hatnote differences below. Izno (talk) 19:45, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

So, these were caused by the work in phab:T361573 and elsewhere. I've filed phab:T367462 for a resolution. Izno (talk) 20:01, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Please have a look at the infobox on 2024 European Parliament election in Ireland to see another issue this has caused. Why was it even changed in the first place? Was there a strong consensus for this change? The new format is causing many more problems than the old one ever did. Please ping me in your reply. Helper201 (talk) 05:26, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have reported this specific problem at T367462 just in case it is a separate problem from the other problems in this section. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:05, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. You can see another issue in this - Next Australian federal election - infobox as well. Helper201 (talk) 06:33, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And another - 2017 United Kingdom general election. Helper201 (talk) 08:31, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And more: 2024 European Parliament election, 2024 European Parliament election in Denmark, 2024 European Parliament election in Finland, 2024 European Parliament election in Germany, 2024 European Parliament election in Latvia, 2024 European Parliament election in Malta, 2024 European Parliament election in Poland, 2024 European Parliament election in Portugal, 2024 European Parliament election in Romania (see the middle overstretching in the middle as well as the extension outside of the infobox in this example), 2024 European Parliament election in Sweden. Helper201 (talk) 08:57, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The latest post on "phabricator" says "We can either inverse the media queries for those hatnotes/infobox.less for now. (only apply at lower resolutions), or revert." I don't have an account on this platform but my vote in 100% revert this infobox change and return to how things were on Wednesday 12 June. Helper201 (talk) 09:25, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've been seeing issues with {{Infobox film}} which I assume are a result of this change. If no image is used in the infobox, then the width is set so low that even average-length names get split across two lines (see Normal Love for an example). hinnk (talk) 09:58, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Multi-column tables in infoboxes aligned badly

split from the section above for tracking purposes

Bad infobox formatting on Chris Dangerfield

This seems to have broken a lot of infoboxes. The career history of every association football player is a misaligned mess; see the screenshot I've attached for an example. It seems like this change needs to be reverted until it's more polished. –IagoQnsi (talk) 20:12, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Consider that your specific example is also how it displays on mobile and you should consider how best to remedy that regardless. This just made the issue visible for desktop as well. There probably needs to be some work done on the template to support small resolutions. Izno (talk) 20:25, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The footballers infoboxes look nasty now it's true. CNC (talk) 21:48, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
A four-column table should be four columns. Not four items placed at seemingly-random horizontal alignments. I checked, and the HTML has the data as a table with several rows and four cells per row. Now, HTML tables go right back to HTML 3.2 (27 years ago), and it's always been the case that tables having multiple rows and multiple columns are presented in such a way that each cell is the same width as the other cells in the same column. How can this have been screwed up so badly? It looks as if all of the cells in a row have been merged into one, with proportionate spacing between the items. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 22:19, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We have a chicken-egg problem. The issue here is that the infobox is currently a table element. Using the table for this element is bad, as it is difficult to consistently make tables friendly on a mobile device. For mobile devices, we currently resort to using display: flex.
Hopefully this GIF demonstrates the problem we are talking about here and how it impacts our mobile users (please click):
thumb
Some wikis have successfully moved away from using a table for this reason. For example fr:Pic_de_Guadeloupe. English hasn't been able to move away from a table so easily, as many infoboxes like this example rely heavily on the status quo that it is a table.
The correct solution here would be to insert a table inside the relevant infobox section and not rely on the fact it will always be a table.
I've applied a change to Module:Infobox3cols to restore the old behaviour for now - but I hope we can agree this is not a long term solution. 🐸 Jdlrobson (talk) 01:28, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks. That fixed the column alignment. The infobox is still incredibly wide, much wider than it used to be and much wider than on Vector legacy, and there is also far too much vertical padding. I hope that fixes to the tickets tracked here will undo those changes. Also, it is not clear to me that French Wikipedia uses something other than tables for infoboxes. fr:Diego Maradona's infobox definitely uses a table for its infobox layout. fr:Pic_de_Guadeloupe, which does not use an infobox, also uses tables for layout of its taxobox, inside of div tags. – Jonesey95 (talk) 01:56, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry I should have clarified - French Wikipedia still has legacy infoboxes that they are trying to migrate away from. If you inspect the newer ones tend to come from newer infobox templates! 🐸 Jdlrobson (talk) 03:45, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Links to examples of post-migration French infoboxes would be magnifique. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:06, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
fr:Projet:Infobox/V3 is probably the best entry point! 🐸 Jdlrobson (talk) 16:06, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Font size change

split from the section above for tracking purposes

For me, at least, the font size in infoboxes has changed to 90% of the default size instead of 88%, which it has been forever. In Vector 2010, the font size in infoboxes is still 88%. I am looking at John Dalton, for example. I have the (formerly default) "small" font size selected as my prose body font preference in the new radio-button switcher on the right-side toolbar. – Jonesey95 (talk) 19:50, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Is the small size also related to the massive line spacing as well? Is that visible for everyone else? microbiologyMarcus [petri dish·growths] 20:09, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Line spacing inside infoboxes? Yes, that would be this change. Line spacing outside? Probably worth a different section Izno (talk) 20:52, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Dear MediaWiki designers, dividers can be either gaps or lines – there is absolutely no need to use both approaches together, as this consumes valuable space and adds visual noise at the same time without producing any benefits. — Mikhail Ryazanov (talk) 06:23, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And why .infobox td has that damn padding in hard-coded pixels instead of font units?! — Mikhail Ryazanov (talk) 07:24, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
A font size change this minor can have a significant impact, as in Louisville, Kentucky, two of the image descriptions in the montage went from two to three lines. I may have to change to a combined description as a cleanup, unless, of course, the font size is reverted back. Stefen Towers among the rest! Gab • Gruntwerk 06:56, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I just changed a couple images to make the descriptions go back to two lines. Image widths make a difference in this case. And it so happens I was able to select images that focused more on the entities they represent. Stefen Towers among the rest! Gab • Gruntwerk 15:54, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You should t be relying on fontsize to begin with. Ever. —TheDJ (talk • contribs) 17:11, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not "relying on fontsize". I never set any font size involved here. I just want to ensure things display well given the typical display settings and relative sizes of things. If anything, I have made the display less brittle due to underlying font size changes. And that's the point. Stefen Towers among the rest! Gab • Gruntwerk 19:50, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've noticed a significant decrease in font size across all text, not just infoboxes, while using the Vector 2010 skin on my iPad since the style changes. Here's a screenshot for reference. @Jonesey95: do you know if this is a separate issue? Thanks, ‑‑Neveselbert (talk · contribs · email) 17:53, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Unrelated. This issue only applied to Vector 2022 skin. 🐸 Jdlrobson (talk) 19:55, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Biographical infoboxes

Biographical infoboxes suddenly got much larger! Anybody know what is going on? Hawkeye7 (discuss) 21:55, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hawkeye7, please see section #Infobox problems above. —⁠andrybak (talk) 21:58, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hatnotes have Minerva-style background color?

Look at the documentation for {{hatnote}} under Vector 2022. A WP:THURSDAY just happened; is there some change in MediaWiki that would've caused this? The CSS indicates that the change is intended to apply to any responsive skin. Aaron Liu (talk) 19:21, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Is it possibly related this change to Module:Message box/fmbox.css? Oops, that was a month ago, but the class seems to be affected. With a bit more digging, that change seems unrelated. Probably something in the MediaWiki code itself, probably related to dark mode changes. – Jonesey95 (talk) 19:38, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've made some notes above. Regarding specifically hatnotes, you should also consider participating in Module talk:Hatnote#Mobile styling, which I started some time ago. Izno (talk) 20:01, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Not keen on the new look at all, this is something that should have been agreed. Also, the font on the hatnotes looks smaller than it used to, it was a slight strain to read it on my laptop... this seems like a MOS:ACCESS issue if nothing else - small text is a huge no no.  — Amakuru (talk) 08:51, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox madness

OK, does anyone know what is going on with infoboxes right now? The formatting is all askew as of the past 10 minutes or so. Stefen Towers among the rest! Gab • Gruntwerk 22:04, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Came here to raise similar concerns. We have articles like SS United States with two infoboxes tucked inside one another having extraordinarily wiiiiide boxes, to the point that articles are hard to read. I've seen broken infoboxes thinner than the current ones.
Yesterday, I was set to the old 2010 display settings. Who's screwing with the new vector display? GGOTCC (talk) 22:21, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Annnnd it's fixed! Check Thursday 13 June style changes above for more info. GGOTCC (talk) 22:23, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The pages I'm looking at are not fixed. I work on pages for Star Wars characters and have done a lot of work to get infobox items to stay on one line. Now they're wrapping to a second line. Wafflewombat (talk) 22:26, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, the worst of it has apparently been corrected, but I'm still seeing things out of whack. Stefen Towers among the rest! Gab • Gruntwerk 22:27, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Definitely not fixed yet in Vector 2022. The borders are still missing, and there are new, unnecessary borders between the rows, with excessive vertical spacing. The font size is also still at 90% instead of 88%, which is wrong. – Jonesey95 (talk) 23:37, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Are the borders suppose to be missing? When I first saw it, I thought the change was to improve ascetics. GGOTCC (talk) 00:29, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, this appears to be an issue with the Vector (2022) skin. Infoboxes look fine on the old Vector. Stefen Towers among the rest! Gab • Gruntwerk 22:25, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Others on this page are wondering the same thing. Some infoboxes now have far less space for content, which messes everything up. Wafflewombat (talk) 22:23, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If I may summarize the key problem I'm seeing at this point, it's when you have a tabular presentation within the infobox, the first column is hogging up too much width. Stefen Towers among the rest! Gab • Gruntwerk 22:45, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Perhaps, although the infoboxes seem thinner altogether, like there is simply less room for text overall. Or perhaps the text is just bigger than it was before? For me, changing the skin to 2010 doesn't fix the issue. Wafflewombat (talk) 22:47, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
From what I'm seeing, that is the appearance because first columns (usually data descriptions) are being given lots of extra width at the expense of second columns (the data). Stefen Towers among the rest! Gab • Gruntwerk 23:15, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Just my 2¢ I'm working on Præsidenten fra Nordvest and the infobox looks so strange with the width being the size of the image. It looks inconsistent with other films like Batman (1989 film) (which I presume the width maxes out when there's a line break in one of the cells). The new infoboxes look the same as mobile-view, so it feels like a mobilificiation. Do style changes like this have a consensus discussion before changing? Svampesky (talk) 23:11, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox thumbnail-sized images are a few pixels too small

FWIW, thumb-sized images now show slightly smaller than my chosen preference (300px) in infoboxes in Vector 2022. A normal thumbnail or frameless image shows as 300px, and the same image in Template:Infobox person (which defaults to the "frameless" image size option) shows as 295px.

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Jonesey95/sandbox&oldid=1228927316

When I force the view to Vector legacy, both images are the same, correct, size. Vector 2022's style sheets do not appear to be respecting users' (or at least my) preferred image thumbnail size. Maybe it's just me. I entered the above info into T367462, but it might be a separate bug. – Jonesey95 (talk) 00:00, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

See Izno's message above about T367463. —⁠andrybak (talk) 00:09, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
These images are not minuscule; they are just a little smaller than they should be, about 1.5% too small. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:03, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
My mistake. I've struck link to the incorrect ticket. —⁠andrybak (talk) 10:04, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Other images (which are not in infoboxes) have also shrunk. The images in the {{Public art row}} template in List of public art in the London Borough of Ealing § Acton are now minuscule, but the portrait-format images in List of public art in the London Borough of Ealing § Ealing are the size they ought to be. Ham II (talk) 06:56, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Take a look at Wikipedia:Top 25 Report or any other page in Category:Wikipedia Top 25 Report; all of them them have images set to 100px inside a wikitable, but the displayed images are much smaller than what it should be... Vestrian24Bio (TALK) 14:29, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

How do I get these style changes on my local MW install?

I just noticed the new look of the infobox and am wondering how I can get this to my local MediaWiki install. I've already used Special:Export with Template:Infobox and Module:Infobox with Include templates on, but the changes have not applied. Anything I've forgotten to import? A diehard editor (talk | edits) 00:48, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A diehard editor, because it is WP:THURSDAY, these changes are caused by the latest deployment of a new version of MediaWiki, which is 1.43.0-wmf.9 (see Special:Version). These changes are considered to be a bug. It was reported to the bug tracker at phab:T367462 and phab:T367463. —⁠andrybak (talk) 01:04, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, so it's not supposed to be like this on desktop, and I should not bring them over? I'm still on 1.42. A diehard editor (talk | edits) 01:07, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Infoboxes

Who and what changed the infoboxs to their new format in the last 24 or 48 hours? It’s causing issues I'd to let them know about. Where do I do this? Helper201 (talk) 05:21, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This was a change to the MediaWiki code. Nobody at the English Wikipedia caused it. See above. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:03, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Jonesey95 can you please give me the link to the MediaWiki page where this decision came about or where on MediaWiki to present the issues this change has caused? Helper201 (talk) 06:17, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ombox images sometimes not showing

Screenshot illustrating the problem.
Screenshot illustrating what it should look like.

Seems like there is a problem with {{ombox}} where sometimes images are not showing up, see e.g. {{sockpuppet}}. Mz7 (talk) 06:28, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That's phab:T367463. Vector 2022 is now being affected by the same issues which affected Minerva (mobile) and Timeless skins for a long time (phab:T282588). —⁠andrybak (talk) 09:36, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
{{tmbox}} got a workaround applied in Special:Diff/1228936760. —⁠andrybak (talk) 09:40, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've submitted a request to apply the same workaround to {{ombox}}. —⁠andrybak (talk) 10:42, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  Workaround has been applied. —⁠andrybak (talk) 19:35, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Andrybak: Thank you so much for your help on that! Mz7 (talk) 10:09, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox & Hatnotes

What just happened? Infoboxes and Hatnotes on Vector 2022 looks similar to that on Minerva... Is it any of my scripts or is it the new MediaWiki software causing these madness??? Vestrian24Bio (TALK) 07:37, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

How hatnote looks like in Minerva
How hatnote now looks like in Vector 2022
How hatnote should look like (Vector)
Added screenshots for reference. Vestrian24Bio (TALK) 08:46, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Vestrian24Bio, you started this subsection "Infobox & Hatnotes" of the big section #Thursday 13 June style changes. Please see other subsections for details about infoboxes and hatnotes. All issues highlighted in your screenshots are already being discussed there. —⁠andrybak (talk) 09:13, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Got it. Thanks! Vestrian24Bio (TALK) 09:16, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's not the skin; it's the parser

Earlier this week, Wikimedia newsletter stated this week they are making changes to the HTML parser; even though it was supposed to only effect the citations, looks like its effecting other things as well.

I just tried breaking the parsing process and the images, hatnotes and even the infoboxes looked just like how they were yesterday and had none of these problems other than broken rendering. (Same for the Parsoid and Legacy as well) Vestrian24Bio (TALK) 14:47, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Blue background for section hatlinks making them almost illegible

Combination of tiny font and pale blue background is making section hatlinks almost illegible and major eyestrain on my laptop. The text size does not increase with selecting larger text from the appearance menu. This combination with excessively small text in edit boxes is untenable. I am now spending too much time zooming in and out when I could be actually improving content. · · · Peter Southwood (talk): 12:37, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Is this part of Wikipedia:Village_pump_(technical)#Thursday_13_June_style_changes above or something different? Can you provide a link to an example, if you are on mobile or desktop, your skin, and your viewport size? — xaosflux Talk 13:17, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It is part of #Thursday 13 June style changes. Vestrian24Bio (TALK) 14:22, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Friday message from the Web team

Hey everyone, this is the Web team working on skins. We wanted to explain the situation, apologize, and share what will happen next. Thank you all for reporting and helping us fix things.

This week, we released styling changes to hatnotes, templates, and images. Some of these changes were not intended for rollout this week. Our focus was mostly on "Images should be responsive in Vector and restrained to a max-size" (T113101) and related tasks. We apologize for introducing bugs and making editors confused.

We read concerns shared on different wikis and on Discord, and went over our options. We decided to revert all changes to templates and hatnotes for the time being, and keep the changes to images. Next, we'll review the changes to templates and hatnotes, and bring them for discussion one by one prior to proceeding. If you notice any remaining issues with images, please report them in comments to this Phabricator ticket. We hope to have a fix for the remaining issue on Monday.

Thank you! SGrabarczuk (WMF) (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@SGrabarczuk (WMF) thanks for addressing us here! These changes seem massively consequential. Was the mistake the rollout of these changes or were these changes not supposed to be as broken as they were, i.e. it wasn't properly tested but the changes where rolled out as planned? microbiologyMarcus [petri dish·growths] 18:52, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hey @MicrobiologyMarcus. The former - the mistake was the rollout of changes to hatnotes and infoboxes (and maybe other templates too). We only wanted to roll out the changes to images. SGrabarczuk (WMF) (talk) 19:09, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@SGrabarczuk (WMF) Hi! I liked the design for infoboxes that was changed, will it be coming back? Interestingedits (talk) 20:03, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Interestingedits: It had better not be coming back, see #Multi-column tables in infoboxes aligned badly. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 21:46, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Seconded. It caused way too much damage. Some articles had infobox images going off into the border whilst others had them shrinking or seemingly disappearing. Plenty other issues also emerged. They should fix those issues caused by the redesign first before considering whether to bring it back as an actual feature. ThatRandomGuy1 (talk) 21:58, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Just FYI, it is the same infobox design as in the Minerva (mobile) skin. Just an idea if you wanted to switch over. JackFromWisconsin (talk | contribs) 07:46, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the update and your work. For me, there was a bright side to these events: It pushed me to fix display issues in two infoboxes that will make them appear less clunky on mobile. Stefen Towers among the rest! Gab • Gruntwerk 20:10, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Font size change in Vector 2010

Since the style changes, I've noticed a significant decrease in font size across all text, not just infoboxes, while using the Vector 2010 skin on my iPad. Here's a screenshot for reference. ‑‑Neveselbert (talk · contribs · email) 22:54, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

In phab:T349793 the viewport changed from 1000px to 1100px which may explain a feeling of being zoomed out. 🐸 Jdlrobson (talk) 02:28, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Jdlrobson: How can I change it back to how it was? ‑‑Neveselbert (talk · contribs · email) 03:02, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Section headings with links

(putting this here because it seems related, feel free to move if needed) I noticed on mobile web that section headings that include both linked and unlinked text place each type of text into a separate column. I first encountered it at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Film but I'm seeing it elsewhere. Any idea what might have caused it? RunningTiger123 (talk) 21:20, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know what caused it, but as per MOS:NOSECTIONLINKS there shouldn't be links in section headings in any case - Arjayay (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 21:25, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That MOS only applies to ns:0. — xaosflux Talk 13:18, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Unrelated cause to the above, I think this is the heading change previously notified about and how DiscussionTools is or was dealing with stuff in headings? Matma Rex Izno (talk) 21:32, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Stjn just filed phab:T367468 which identifies the issue (it's the flex), but IDK how the future is supposed to be. Izno (talk) 21:33, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yep, not related to the style changes discussed above, it's a bug in the styles I wrote for Minerva for the heading HTML changes rolling out to that skin this week, as noted in Tech News. It affects any formatting in a heading, not just links, and somehow I never thought to test that. Sorry about that, I'll get it fixed soon (Monday at the latest). Matma Rex talk 23:19, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yep, and it happens with italicized text as well ꧁Zanahary꧂ 23:45, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Formatting

I'm here to report a bug. There is a weird format going on where if you go to September 1967 (as an example) and look at the Wednesday and Thursday sections, the dates are in two separate spaces. It is not how its supposed to be set up. This is also goes for pretty much every page that's made for the 1950s, 60s, 70s, etc... I use an android to get on to Wikipedia so it may or may not differ from other devices but I wanna know if this is some kind of bug that can easily be fixed? Arcadia (talk) 23:00, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Section headings on numerous pages are currently glitched when I view the mobile version on my phone. I came here to report a similar issue with Matchbox Twenty; the section "Yourself or Someone Like You lawsuit" gets broken up with the album title on the left and "lawsuit" broken up into "law sui t" on three separate lines over to the right. Home Lander (talk) 00:00, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's the same problem as #Section headings with links above. It should get fixed on Monday. Matma Rex talk 08:49, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Subheadings containing italics example text lorem ipsum

I was organising my user page and noticed that the part of the subheading in italics appeared strange in the mobile view. I visited articles to see if the issue was in the main space. I checked music articles like Madonna and Nirvana, as they would have italic subheadings when discussing their works and the issue is present. If this issue has already been noted, please direct me to it and close this discussion. On mobile view, it looks like it creates a table and puts the part in italics in a cell. Svampesky (talk) 15:16, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This also happens with wikilinks in headings... Janhrach (talk) 15:19, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Update: It's discussed above, see #Section headings with links. Janhrach (talk) 15:23, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Search box

In My Preferences: Vector (2022) removes my search box, Vector legacy (2010) restores it. Any ideas? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:09, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Vector 2022 is responsive. I can reproduce that at screen width below 1120 pixels, the search box disappears, but a flat button with magnifying glass icon (or in dark mode) appears. Clicking on it shows the search box. To focus on the search box, you can also use accesskey F.
Does this correspond to what you encountered? What width screen are you using? —⁠andrybak (talk) 21:57, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Many thanks for the advice. Now resolved. Martinevans123 (talk) 08:21, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved
–Novem Linguae (talk) 03:04, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Can a caption in a group of images span an entire row?

There is a large amount of empty space next to this caption. Is it possible to make this caption span the entire row of images, so that no space is left empty next to the caption?
This footer spans an entire row of images, unlike the caption above.

See the discussion here: is it possible to display a caption using {{Multiple image}} that spans a row of images? Jarble (talk) 16:42, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Everything is possible, but shoving all possible functionality into a single template is generally a bad idea and creates a maintenance nightmare. —TheDJ (talk • contribs) 17:09, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@TheDJ: If this template doesn't have this capability, which template should I use instead to display images in this format? Jarble (talk) 21:05, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think we have a template for this and don't see a big need for it. You could use {{multiple image}} more than once and use the footer parameter when wanted. The images will be split into separate boxes with a gap but is that so bad? At least it would be very clear what the captions apply to. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:11, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

How to create a redirect or even new article if one letter is capitalized?

I had a hard time creating MaryLand because it kept redirecting to Maryland. I found there was a way around the problem if I added an extra letter and then deleted it in the URL when creating the article.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 22:59, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

If you search for a title like MarYlAnD that doesn't exist except with different capitalization, it'll take you to one of those existing variations. You can get to the nonexisting title by typing the correct title into the url or by clicking on a redlink like MarYlAnD. SilverLocust 💬 23:29, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You could just add ?redirect=no to an URL to avoid redirects or just use the NoRedirect script. Vestrian24Bio (TALK) 02:37, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This wasn't actually a redirect, so that wouldn't have made any difference. SilverLocust 💬 02:58, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Vchimpanzee: You can click "Search for pages containing" in the dropdown below the search box. Then you will not go directly to a matching page name. If the searched term is not an exact page name including the same capitalization then you get an option to create the page. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:19, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
SilverLocust mentioned what I did, but I don't get a dropdown below the search box. Maybe it's because I use Monobook. Anyway, Vestrian24Bio had the best solution.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 15:42, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Vchimpanzee: Please always say from the start if you don't use the default skin when you ask for interface help. MonoBook has a "Search" button below the search box with the same functionality as the Vector dropdown "Search for pages containing". PrimeHunter (talk) 19:08, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

High quantity of poor edits to short descriptions

I suddenly see a swarm IPs and newbie editors happily adding short descriptors in my watchlist of 20K+ pages. Today, "assuming good faith" I reviewed a couple hundred edits and notified several editors to go careful with these. And suddenly I paid attention that it looks like some tool was rolled out which puts edit summary "Added short description, #suggestededit-add-desc 1.0" and of course this bot screws up numerous articles because it is brainless and newbies brainlessly follow stupid advices. Whatever the feature is, it must be disabled ASAP for editors without extended confirmed status, because it increases unnecessary workload on other wikipedians. It takes much more time to confirm validity of such an edit (because it comes from who knows who) compared to brainlessly clicking some button. And developers deserve a trout slap for a tool that suggests edits to people who have no idea what they are doing. - Altenmann >talk 03:12, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Broadly agree, although I think any relative newbie could add a short description if they've checked the guidelines and looked at SDs on similar pages to the one they're editing. But there is probably no automated way to get people to do that. I'm not familiar with the tool in question, does it mention the general best practices for SDs? It could be limited to articles that are very easy to give a good SD, such as albums. Wizmut (talk) 04:27, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If a noob makes an edit per 1 minute in widely disparate areas, I doubt best practices help them without domain knowledge. - Altenmann >talk 04:44, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sounds like Wikipedia:Suggestededit-add 1.0. -- Malcolmxl5 (talk) 07:08, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't see the feature being the issue. It's an editor making edits as quickly as possible without giving any care to whether they are useful or not. Traumnovelle (talk) 07:41, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
What the editor is motivated/thinks is constructive to do is informed an awful lot by the user interface. Remsense诉 07:51, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
He could've made poor edits to other articles via the suggested edits thing regarding copy editing. Traumnovelle (talk) 07:55, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And you know what? people were complaining about this several times on several issues (including mine), and the tool still runs.
Someone deserves a BIG trout.- Altenmann >talk 09:22, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Again, there's a phabricator ticket about it. Devs have a lot of work to do. Remsense诉 09:27, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Then it must be disabled until fixed. Don't you think editors have a lot of work to do other than struggling with screw-ups of devs? If I tell my customers "our devs have a lot to do", they will say "goodbye, we will renew our contract once your devs become less busy". - Altenmann >talk 09:33, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Shrug. It's annoying to me, but I can't easily summon your level of frustration. Remsense诉 09:34, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Do you have a link to the Phabricator ticket handy? That is the quickest way to read up on the issue and also to tell the devs. –Novem Linguae (talk) 03:02, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The WMF doesn't want to help you, they want to feel good. Cremastra (talk) 20:50, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes the feature is an issue. It is a suggested edit. A novice would normally think they should trust the suggestion supposedly coming from someone smarter (not). Therefore I came here to take the blame off the novice and put in on tool owners. - Altenmann >talk 09:33, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Where in the suggestion does it tell you to add something like the article's title as the description? It directs the editor to the feature/function but doesn't tell them what to write. Traumnovelle (talk) 10:16, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Whatever. Still, my point is that this feature should not be available to random IPs who often no clue to write and also have no clue that in this case they should not write (Dunning–Kruger effect :-) and my suggestion was to permit "Edit suggester" only to extended confirmed users. - Altenmann >talk 21:01, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Have you seen IPs do this? The feature Malcolmxl5 mentioned, in commons, claims to be logged-in users only. – 2804:F1...54:15BE (talk) 21:06, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oops, you are right. I reviewed my contribs, with plenty of recerts of IPs, and only logged-in users have "uggestededit-add-desc " in edit summary. Still, I am standing with my suggestion to increase level to extended confirmed status. - Altenmann >talk 00:03, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
How bad are these edits? Can you provide a couple diffs of edits you fixed/reverted? How many edits did you check and what percent of those are problematic? Can this be fixed by warning a couple people or do we need to get a consensus for an edit filter to block these edits? (If the latter, we should probably start an AN/ANI thread.) –Novem Linguae (talk) 03:01, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The edits of this one editor are very poor – I had to revert at least two-thirds of the recent ones – and that editor has been asked to stop. I don't know if there is a systemic problem with the tool or if this is just a single-editor CIR problem. If there is a way that an edit filter could prevent the "suggested edits" tool from changing a short description of "none" to something else, contrary to instructions, that would be great. T326898 has been waiting for action for over a year, and it is not fixed yet. It is always disappointing when the developers roll out shiny new toys and then don't stick around to fix them. – Jonesey95 (talk) 04:30, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Dragging a url from the &action=edit text area into the search box

Why does drag-and-dropping an url from the page editor's textarea (and seemingly only from there) into the search box strip most of the url?
Steps:

  1. Go to
  2. Put the link somewhere in the editor's text area
  3. Select that text and drag and drop it into the search box at the top of the page
  4. Observe how the text that showed up was index.php

This doesn't happen only with urls, any text that starts with text: gets altered.
What I expected was for the link to not be altered, which is what happens if you drag and drop while holding ctrl (a copy drag and drop).
I'm on Google Chrome (v 125.0.6422.142, Official Build, 64-bit), desktop. – 2804:F1...C5:7348 (talk) 04:37, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • For anyone looking in to this, the user story can be a bit simpler. It doesn't matter what the link is (e.g. https://www.google.com/search?q=things works); also it isn't about the "search box" - same behavior can be seen "drag/drop" a link within the edit box. — xaosflux Talk 09:40, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Ah. I put 2 and 2 together, i.e. looked at your comment and @Nardog's below, and turns out this is just an issue with Google Chrome (Chromium?) in general?
    The same thing happens if you go to the google search link you gave, paste the link at the start of Google's search box and then drag it to the other side of the word things. No wonder I couldn't find anything in the JavaScript backtrace of the preview search request. – 2804:F14:8086:B701:BF:AF2B:7254:15BE (talk) 19:31, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Thanks, looks like you've confirmed this is a quirk of Chromium, and not a Wikipedia, or Mediawiki issue. Chromium bugs can be reported here: https://issues.chromium.org/issues/wizard — xaosflux Talk 20:29, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Seems like this 2019 issue that they never fixed and were unable to reproduce: https://issues.chromium.org/issues/41437089.
    A fun example from there: drag-and-dropping a text that starts with data: followed by something that has a space (like data: a) turns into the word download! wow.
    Thanks for the help. – 2804:F14:8086:B701:BF:AF2B:7254:15BE (talk) 21:01, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Appears specific to Chromium. Nardog (talk) 10:08, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What causes banners made with Module:WikiProject banner to collapse when placed inside {{WPBS}}. I imported that module among others to another wiki and everything works, except the banners don't collapse automatically. I've looked in Module:WikiProject banner/styles.css, Module:Banner shell/styles.css, Module:Message box/tmbox.css, and even the Vector.css and it eludes me. Could someone point me in the right direction? –Fredddie™ 04:56, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Fredddie: Module:WikiProject banner adds the class innercollapse which has code in MediaWiki:Common.js and MediaWiki:Common.css. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:17, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Huh that did the trick. It must have been the Common.js because I already had Common.css. Thanks for the quick reply. –Fredddie™ 16:47, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved
–Novem Linguae (talk) 02:51, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Size for text renderings at Zero-width non-joiner

I need help resizing the Bengali and Telugu render images in the table to appear the correct size, matching the x-large font size (Example Text) when viewed on desktop using default settings. It may be preferable to replace them with unpadded SVGs. The Malay Jawi script renderings are in the correct format, but at a very large native size, and the sizes of those images in the ZWNJ article should be double-checked. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 07:01, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Is AFDStats down?

I've been sitting here about half an hour trying to pull up my AFD stats (https://afdstats.toolforge.org/afdstats.py?name=Maile66&max=&startdate=&altname=) and it just hangs in a never-ending loop. — Maile (talk) 11:57, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

My Toolforge bot has been working fine. This is probably a software-specific issue. Dragoniez (talk) 13:11, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Meaning, I guess, the MediaWiki software, because the AFD stats were working perfectly when I edited yesterday, and nothing has changed on my computer. — Maile (talk) 13:48, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It finally came up, but took two hours to finally complete. Hope this gets better soon. — Maile (talk) 15:29, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

FYI - Here we are eight hours later, and absolutely nothing has changed as far as the hours it takes to pull up the AFD Stats. Something is not good somewhere. — Maile (talk) 23:30, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It looks like the tool is semi-abandoned, but User:Legoktm has semi-adopted it. I've contacted him off-wiki and he says he'll take a look when he gets back to a keyboard. RoySmith (talk) 01:28, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And, yes, it sure looks like it fell down and can't get up. I'm getting python stack dumps. RoySmith (talk) 01:30, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you! Thank you! We don't know how much we rely on something until it falls down on its job. — Maile (talk) 02:19, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The homepage is still up so the tool is not down completely. A query for my AFD stats completed after several minutes so is going much slower than it should. The only thing this tool does to interface with MediaWiki is via a couple mw:Action API queries, so I think it's unlikely that MediaWiki is the culprit. Maybe the webserver needs to be restarted, or maybe we need to step debug the python code and see if something there is slowing things down. –Novem Linguae (talk) 02:46, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks Roy for the ping. The database server queries are taking much slower than they should (I just killed one that had been running for 30 minutes!). s1 replag is currently ~4 hours, which might be the cause or another symptom of something else.
I applied one small performance fix and restarted it and now it seems to returning results, so one of those two did the trick. Legoktm (talk) 05:02, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Also if someone has some time, the tool is running as a legacy CGI application running under lighttpd. Would be great if we could convert it to a proper WSGI application (e.g. flask) or ... port it to Rust. Legoktm (talk) 05:06, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Outdated GA review still hanging around on an article talk page

If someone around here who isn't as exhausted as I am today would please visit Talk:Tiny Town (miniature park), there is an old GA assessment I did - see the GA1 (show) line - that needs to be moved off the article talk into wherever. I can't remember how to make that happen and if you did that it would be awesome. Thanks, Shearonink (talk) 19:22, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

An ending </div> was missing so it combined with the following section. This was fixed by [4]. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:39, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
omg. it's the little things ain't it... thank yooooooou. Shearonink (talk) 00:48, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
O wise PrimeHunter...the next thing is this: Since the GA Review is outdated etc how does one make it go off the main article talk/go away? GA Reviews don't hang around forever right? Don't laugh, I should know this but it's been a long day.... I think I can just archive the GA Review at its actual talk page - Talk:Tiny Town (miniature park)/GA1 which will then archive the GA Review to Talk:Tiny Town (miniature park)/Archive 1 and all will be well. Lol I confess I'm always concerned I'll break something around here... Please confirm and thanks - Shearonink (talk) 01:01, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If you want to make it auto archivable, you'd probably want to wrap it in a level 2 heading and a signature. Then since you don't have WP:AUTOARCHIVE set up, either set that up, or one click archive it. –Novem Linguae (talk) 02:31, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Shearonink and Novem Linguae: I have noticed that newly-created GANs and GARs are generally transcluded into a totally unrelated section, whichever one happened to be last on the talk page when Legobot popped by. Once the GAN/GAR is over, it's no longer an ongoing discussion; but it seems that Legobot has no post-GA clearup task, and it's left for a manual edit.
I have never come across anybody wrapping a GAN/GAR in the manner that you describe, whether to be bot-archived or not; and generally speaking, it's not necessary to retain it since either the {{GA}} box or the article history box should already link to it. When I find that a talk page still transcludes a closed GAN/GAR, I first make sure that it's linked from the article history box together with its outcome, and then I simply de-transclude it, like this. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 08:13, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for this info. I maintain the user script that closes a lot of GANs and GARs. I just checked and the script's closing algorithm leaves these template transclusions in place. GAN example. GAR example.
Perhaps we should have a wider discussion about what to do with these on the WT:GAN and WT:GAR talk pages. The fact that they're not wrapped means they don't get auto archived and hang around forever. Perhaps there's a work instruction we can get consensus to update somewhere, and we could ask that it be updated to wrap these in headings and signatures so that they don't hang around forever. –Novem Linguae (talk) 08:32, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There should be no need to archive it, as it's technically already archived - GANs and GARs are talk subpages, albeit ones that don't contain the word "Archive" in their names, for example Talk:Kurt Wolff (aviator)/GA1. As I mentioned, for anybody curious about reading the text of the GAN/GAR, these pages are linked from one of the boxes at the top of the talk page - either {{GA}} or {{article history}}. Please can we not suggest creating a process that is more complex than it needs to be: simple de-transclusion should be quite sufficient. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 10:22, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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