Hosta

This is a collection of discussions on the deletion of articles related to Germany. It is one of many deletion lists coordinated by WikiProject Deletion sorting. Anyone can help maintain the list on this page.

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Germany

Imperium (film series)

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The article is unsourced. I don't see why this topic deserves an article as there are no sources on the Imperium series, only sources on the individual movies. MKsLifeInANutshell (talk) 05:07, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Film, History, and Romania. MKsLifeInANutshell (talk) 05:07, 22 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Why was this sorted in the Romania-related discussions? Some of the production companies involved are Spanish/German/French but I see no participation of Romanian actors or producers. -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 11:45, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 03:36, 29 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 03:45, 5 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The answer to the nom's implicit question is that Wikipedia:Notability, right at the top, says that we can merge up articles into a bigger subject. See also Wikipedia talk:Notability (books)#Should NBOOK cover series or just individual books?, which has almost 150 comments on a closely related subject. See statements like "Where a source contains coverage of one of the books in a series of books, this coverage is deemed to be coverage of the series of books, in addition to being coverage of that book" and "Articles on book series may be created in some cases where there are no series-level sources, drawing on the sourcing of the individual books." WhatamIdoing (talk) 04:24, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

WhatamIdoing, what outcome are you arguing for? Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 23:32, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

If I'm not wrong I'm pretty sure he's saying that keep is the answer, even though what he's talking about is the Notability for books. MK at your service. 03:29, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

WhatamIdoing indicates in her preferences that she would like to be referred to as she. -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 11:32, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

True, but if you don't have WP:NAVPOPS installed, it's not usually convenient to look up those settings. Innocent mistakes never bother me. WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:16, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Liz, I'm not sure whether it should be kept and converted to an article (e.g., adding paragraphs and sources), kept as a WP:SETINDEX, or converted to a WP:DAB page. But I don't think overall that we solve any problems by deleting it. WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:14, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Final relist, last hope for some more participation.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 03:28, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: Although the series is a loose one, the miniseries that are part of the set are all RAI productions and seem to be part of the same project indeed. I favour a keep, as the page helps navigation as a disambiguation page does. I would rename it but not sure how, because most of the "films" were broadcast as miniseries... Imperium (miniseries series) would be a terrible name! Imperium (TV productions)? Sources would not hurt either. Would redirect and merge to/into Imperium (disambiguation) be a suitable WP:ATD?? -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 11:29, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Television, Italy, and United Kingdom. -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 11:39, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Christianity, France, Germany, and Spain. -My, oh my! (Mushy Yank) 11:48, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Saimir Kasemi

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Fails WP:GNG. The subject made two appearances in the German fifth tier in 2007 but it appears they have made no professional appearances at all. A web search finds a few articles about an ice cream parlour they have been running after their retirement. But there's no WP:SIGCOV relating to their football career. Robby.is.on (talk) 08:22, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople and Football. Robby.is.on (talk) 08:22, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Albania and Germany. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 10:47, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete – Fails in WP:GNG. Svartner (talk) 13:25, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: There's no evidence of any further professional career, lacks WP:SIGCOV. Waqar💬 16:39, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ursula Münzner-Linder

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Delete: Fails NMUSICIAN and reliable sourcing to confirm notability. Tkaras1 (talk) 02:03, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Only reliable and accessible sourcing I could find by Google search was this link, which alone does not seem sufficient. Her name is apparently not even spelled correctly! Tkaras1 (talk) 02:06, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Bands and musicians, Women, and Germany. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 04:21, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ennepetal hostage taking

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Article on a hostage taking that lasted one day from 19 years ago, created the day of the hostage taking, uncited even then. Article has sat largely untouched for the past two decades. There are sources exclusively from the day this happened. The only thing I found that wasn't from the actual day this occurred was a 1 paragraph mention in a list of German hostage crises from 2010, which does not have enough detail to build an article from.

Fails WP:NEVENT. PARAKANYAA (talk) 23:26, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Crime and Germany. PARAKANYAA (talk) 23:26, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 00:07, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - I don't speak German but I'm not seeing a reason to think this has lasting coverage. WP:NOTNEWS JMWt (talk) 09:24, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: This article doesn't seem to cover a topic that has significance importance. Deletion might be the best course of action here. Waqar💬 17:00, 13 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Emicho

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Article is a mess ~~with multiple WP:BLPVIO issues.~~ The seeming lack of information about Count Emicho outside the wall of text about the First Crusade or Rhineland massacres seems to confirm the article lacks WP: NOTABILITY. The article even had a Holocaust reference in it for whatever reason, until I removed it. Fantastic Mr. Fox (talk) 21:09, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Salutation yet again, I'm going to CV what I said on your talk page.

"it is obvious to me that the article in question is mostly un-sourced, and what sources it does use are secondary or "primary anonymous accounts" which contradict whatever this person did or at least claimed to have done. I might add also that is a point of contention with the Jewish people since most see him as a barbaric Christian who mindlessly killed their peers, also those "primary anonymous accounts" are allegedly written by Jewish authors, which makes this situation even more concerning. History is not about personal vendettas nor is it about claiming that only one party is to blame while the other is innocent. If those alleged did happen then why does not one Christian author (in the article itself) has wrote about it? More likely Emicho has taken the role of a fall guy to blame everything on him as a reflection of Jewish (justified) hatred of Christians." Ukudoks (talk) 21:29, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: History, Royalty and nobility, and Germany. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 21:30, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: Fantastic Mr. Fox, this cannot possibly violate WP:BLP because the subject has been dead for 1,000 years. Curbon7 (talk) 21:38, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
"there were many accounts stating the legend that Emicho's soul is guarding the gate of Rhineland" Did he/she even exist to begin with? For such a notorious individual we know close to absolutely nothing about his/her personal life etc. I agree with :@Fantastic Mr. Fox: that we should delete this article or at least modify it entirely and build from there Ukudoks (talk) 21:44, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep A basic Google search for Emicho of Flonheim (which is probably what this article should be titled) exclusively in English returned a plethora which provide WP:SIGCOV, including but not limited to: two journal articles ([1][2]), at least two biographical dictionary entries ([3][4]), and an entire book chapter ([5]). I have not conducted a search in German, but am reasonably confident SIGCOV-providing sources exist in that language too, as this encyclopedia entry lists two German sources including another journal article specifically about him. Curbon7 (talk) 21:53, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Those historians are using at least four primary sources which have been alleged to be created by Jewish "anonymous accounts", that is the root of our question. How can we know those anonymous sources were telling the truth? Simply put, we don't know

As I've stated above it is a point of contention with Jewish individuals that use it as ammunition (for good reasons too) against the Crusades and/or Christianity.

Thus while it might have a plethora of secondary sources, it doesn't have a plethora of primary sources that at least have a somewhat coherent timeline with what happened. Ukudoks (talk) 22:14, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
With respect, this argument has absolutely no basis in any WP:P&G. An academic source can certainly be unreliable based on the quality (or lack thereof) of their sourcing, but simply being partially sourced to anonymous primary accounts is not itself damning and is in fact quite regular in historical writing. To quote from WP:SECONDARY: A secondary source provides thought and reflection based on primary sources, generally at least one step removed from an event. It contains analysis, evaluation, interpretation, or synthesis of the facts, evidence, concepts, and ideas taken from primary sources. [...] They rely on primary sources for their material, making analytic or evaluative claims about them. Curbon7 (talk) 22:32, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
With all due respect if you look at the references on Emicho's article and Rhineland massacres article it heavily relies on secondary sources. And let us not forget modern biases which cloud almost all historians who work for public institutions, most of them (I'm making an assumption here) are simply regurgitating unrealiable information. Whether or not I can claim what historians are writing and/or telling is the truth or not is irrelevant because all of us know, they are clueless as much as we are.

I think better option is for an independent Wikipedian to look through the surviving archives and find out what really is going on. Ukudoks (talk) 22:42, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. I'm not sure what happening with this article right now, but it used to be perfectly fine. If I remember correctly it was once known as "Emich of Leiningen" but I think it was moved to avoid confusion with another person with the same/a similar name. Anyway he was a real and notable guy and there are plenty of sources about him. Adam Bishop (talk) 22:19, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Those "plenty" sources (I assume that you mean secondary and not primary) are not stated on Wikipedia as far as I can tell. Ukudoks (talk) 22:23, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The only primary sources I can find on wikipedia (relating to Emicho's role in the massacres) are:

Albert of Aix, Historia Hierosolymitana

Mainz Anonymous

Solomon bar Simson Chronicle

Eliezer bar Nathan Chronicle

While others are secondary and therefore unreliable. Ukudoks (talk) 22:27, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Ukudoks Secondary sources are not unreliable; in many ways, secondary sources are preferable to primary sources, according to the academic or editorial rigor they have been subjected to. —C.Fred (talk) 22:43, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Secondary sources are "preferable" because they suit modern interpretations of politics, public institutions and society. I absolutely agree. Ukudoks (talk) 22:45, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I was just thinking, why do I remember the title being Emich of Leiningen? Oh yeah, I'm the one who created this, way back in the olden days, haha. Adam Bishop (talk) 11:39, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: Unless he's some sort of super human that lives for 1000 yrs, I don't think we have to worry about BLP violations. Might not be neutrally written, but AfD isn't cleanup. We have this [6], [7] and the book chapter shown above, it's fine. BDP perhaps, deceased people ? Oaktree b (talk) 22:54, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think that some here do not realize the implications of not using primary sources to back up the crimes he allegedly committed, which is the main point for his existence on Wikipedia Ukudoks (talk) 23:00, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We can't use primary sources, we can only use what others have written about this individual. We can't do original research nor draw our own conclusions. Oaktree b (talk) 00:59, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: I have struck through the BLP statement, I have no clue what was running through my head at the time. The correct wording is that it fails WP:NPOV. Fantastic Mr. Fox (talk) 06:50, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nico Blum

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Non-notable darts player per WP:SPORTCRIT. I found no significant coverage. SL93 (talk) 00:20, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople and Germany. SL93 (talk) 00:21, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Jill Vernekohl

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Fails WP:NSKATE; medal placement at the junior level or bronze/silver medals at the senior-level national championships do not meet the requirements of WP:NSKATE. Nothing since retirement. Google search yields nothing but wikis and scoring databases. PROD removed without explanation. Bgsu98 (Talk) 23:47, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople, Women, Skating, and Germany. Bgsu98 (Talk) 23:47, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Cameron Guarino

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The same article was deleted at Cam Guarino by User:Kuru. I tagged this article for speedy deletion but it was declined by User:GB fan. User:Namiba 02:10, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Baseball and Maine. User:Namiba 02:10, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople, Germany, Connecticut, and Washington, D.C.. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 03:20, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: The article at Cam Guarino was created by a check-user verified paid editing sock evading a block on another account. I've added 'Johnson Abigail' to an existing follow-up. Sam Kuru (talk) 11:02, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have blocked the article's author, Johnson Abigail, as a sock. GB fan - I don't mind allowing this discussion to play out, but I believe that a G5 speedy would now be within policy, and more expedient. You declined the original speedy tag - do you objections to deletion at this point? Girth Summit _(blether) 14:51, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I don't have any objections. At the time I declined, there was no investigation of any kind I could point to. There wasn't even a sock puppet identified that was pointed to. ~ GB fan 15:09, 7 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete and no objection to speedy via G5. Definitely not a notable subject. Season with WP:SALT. – Muboshgu (talk) 19:27, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Dmitri Kurakin

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Fails WP:NSKATE; medal placement at the junior level or bronze/silver medals at the senior-level national championships do not meet the requirements of WP:NSKATE. PROD removed without explanation. Not to be confused with Dmitry Kurakin, sociology professor at Yale University. Bgsu98 (Talk) 00:48, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople, Skating, and Estonia. Bgsu98 (Talk) 00:48, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Germany-related deletion discussions. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 02:12, 4 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Bgsu98: multiple Estonian champion at senior-level championships, see [8] Estopedist1 (talk) 06:53, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 01:31, 11 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Adjustierung

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It seems like this article should be merged into articles about the German and Austrian militaries of various eras, which generally include discussion of uniforms. Just because there is a German word for "military uniform" doesn't mean that word is a distinct topic. We already have military uniform; the military uniforms of German-speaking countries (as opposed to Germany and Austria and Switerland, separately) don't make a natural subtopic of that. -- Beland (talk) 21:15, 27 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions. Beland (talk) 21:15, 27 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Also, the words listed could just be added to Glossary of German military terms. -- Beland (talk) 21:15, 27 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Fashion, Austria, and Germany. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 00:06, 28 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 20:59, 3 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:47, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hosta

Germany

Imperium (film series)

Saimir Kasemi

Ursula Münzner-Linder

Ennepetal hostage taking

Emicho

Nico Blum

Jill Vernekohl

Cameron Guarino

Dmitri Kurakin

Adjustierung

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