Hosta

Add this to-do list to your User page! {{WPRU Announcements}}

Archives

Archive 1, Archive 2, Archive 3, Archive 4, Archive 5, Archive 6, Archive 7

I have just been creating another page (Tony Shaw (rugby)) when I came across this link. I was thinking if we should create a similar page on wikipedia, possibly called list of australian wallabies or list of australian international rugby union players etc etc you get my drift. Or would we not be able to do it because of cipyright (what if we find more links). Await feed-back. De Mattia (talk) 08:26, 27 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There are already pages for complete lists of other nations players, including England, Wales, Ireland and New Zealand. None follow a standard style, with the Irish being the most basic and the Welsh the most data heavy. There is no problem setting up an Australian list but I'm unsure if the Project has a prefered style to use. Check "Category:Rugby union related lists" for the other articles. FruitMonkey (talk) 08:59, 27 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Where are the lists mentioned above (lists of english players etc). I looked but couldn't find them. De Mattia (talk) 22:21, 27 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I couldn't find the England one, but the Wales, Ireland and New Zealand ones can be found at List of Wales national rugby union footballers, List of Ireland national rugby union footballers and List of New Zealand national rugby union footballers respectively. Cheers. – PeeJay 22:37, 27 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The England list uses the same naming convention as the others, i.e. List of England national rugby union footballers.Kwib (talk) 00:21, 28 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

De Mattia, if I was you, I would avoid splitting the List of Australia national rugby union footballers into sections like the England, Ireland and New Zealand ones as it interferes with the sorting of the article. I suggest following the Welsh model. – PeeJay 08:50, 28 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

What do you mean? There isn't a list article for 'Australia'. De Mattia (talk) 06:38, 29 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Which is exactly why you opened this topic of discussion. But when you do start the article, try to follow the Welsh pattern. – PeeJay 16:44, 29 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Would I be able to start by placing say 15 players and then everyone can slowly add more or do I have to place all names in one big hit before I save it for the first time? De Mattia (talk) 09:15, 30 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You can add as many or as few players as you want to start with, but I would suggest working on it in your userspace (say at User:De Mattia/List of Australia national rugby union footballers) and then moving it to the mainspace when it's in a condition that you believe is worthy of publication to the encyclopaedia. And of course, even when the article is in your userspace, people can still work on it with you as a collaborative effort. – PeeJay 10:11, 30 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. Also, is there a page of information on the type of table used in the Welsh list? That is the type of list table I will use in the list but I will need to kow some information about how to use it. Ir will I just have to go 'copy and paste' from the Welsh page and then take it from there? De Mattia (talk) 05:43, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The article is now up and running as a user sub-page here. Will need a lot of work before it can be moved onto the encyclopedia. De Mattia (talk) 07:28, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I like this style of table. When I created the England table, I believe I did not see the Wales version and followed another style. However, the Wales table is a more user friendly version. I have just appended to De Mattia's user page the complete table for all Australian internationals, but left out details such as birth date, death, and the points breakdown. However, I have added to each player's line a hyperlink to the profile of that player on scrum.com in order to make filling in the details easier (because you can navigate to them quickly). I hope that helps.Kwib (talk) 10:03, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

These tables are excellent and the work is great. However, I'd caution against linking every player's name - many of the links in the England article point either to disambiguation pages or to articles about a different person with the same name. Maybe better to set links up to "name (rugby union)" where there isn't an existing article.--Bcp67 (talk) 20:13, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Definitely agree about not linking all the names, as apart from the disambiguation, it also helps us know which players we have addressed. Just thought I should state that I went with the type of scoring achieved by each player in the Welsh list as the points system changed so much from the early days to present times, and can not be compared. Early tries, for instance, carried no points. Not sure if anyone wants to change that?FruitMonkey (talk) 20:48, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Instead of automatically putting a redlink with rugby union as a disambiguation marker I think it would be better to not link to missing articles at all. As for the problem with scoring, maybe split the table at the points where the scoring changed with a brief explanation of the scoring system at the time preceding each table? noq (talk) 23:48, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There is now also a List of South African national rugby union footballers in need of collaboration. Please pitch in! Sahmejil (talk) 18:26, 6 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Some of the Irish Rugby Bios aren't of great quality. I'm starting a clean up of them, beginning with current international players and working onwards from there. Plan is to have them in a similar style as I've done here with:- Alan Quinlan. Any input, help, suggestions etc. would be appreciated. I'm starting with the current Internationals as listed here:[1], first up:- Rory Best GainLine ♠ _♥ 12:35, 29 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It's not just the Irish rugby bios that aren't good quality. In fact, most rugby bios are complete crap, IMO. – PeeJay 16:45, 29 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Tis true! Thought I'd start with the current irish internationals and work form there, could take some time GainLine ♠ _♥ 18:35, 29 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have to admit that I was suprised by both the lack of content within existing bios, and the general lack of bios altogether when browsing for rugby players. This is most apparent with historical figures in the game (and indeed with historical clubs) but does extend into the modern era quite significantly. However, I suppose the predominant reason for a project is to elevate the quality and content of the subject. Does wikiproject rugby union follow the guidelines set out by the overarching wikiproject biography, or does it have its own slant, i.e. a specific rugby union biography template?Kwib (talk) 08:56, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

wikiproject rugy union doesnt seem to be one of the more active projects hence my proposal to start cleaning up Bios, begiining with the irish ones. GainLine ♠ _♥ 14:21, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

In the past few months I have created a few Ireland player articles (Philip Matthews; Nigel Carr; William Tyrrell (RAF officer)) mainly because I happened to be looking up these particular players and found nothing on them. It astonishes me that rugby is so poorly represented on wikipedia in the biographies, but projects such as yours will help enormously.Kwib (talk) 15:52, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

As a project, there isn't much in the way of standardisation and individual editors tend to do their own thing - the bios I've created for example have tended to be very short stubs giving a few basic statistical details.Kwib's ones quoted above are good patterns and also the ones which FruitMonkey has created, usually for Welsh players from historical days - e.g. Billy Bancroft. I've found that newspaper obituaries are quite good sources of biographical information about a player's life outside rugby. Good luck with whatever you do, we need more rugby union contributors!--Bcp67 (talk) 06:02, 2 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello,

In fact, most rugby bios are complete crap, that's true in wikipedia.fr and in wikipedia.en. If you want it, we can better together some bios : look at fr:Sébastien Chabal. We can do the same work with Jonah Lomu and Jonny Wilkinson and...

• Fabien Pelous
• Jean Prat
• Olivier Magne
• Frédéric Michalak
• Raphaël Ibañez
• Christophe Dominici
• Damien Traille
• Gareth Edwards
• Imanol Harinordoquy
• Tana Umaga
• Brian O'Driscoll
• Serge Blanco

or other players in order to have 15 good articles... Ddfree (talk) 20:21, 29 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thats an excellent article. I'm going to aim to get the Irish ones in order first then a bit of collaboration to maybe get some rugby Bios to good article status could be in order. GainLine ♠ _♥ 08:41, 30 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Here are other great players, 15 of them could have a good article status...

Ddfree (talk) 17:17, 3 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello !

We are working on fr:Jonny Wilkinson... If you want to do it too... Ddfree (talk) 21:49, 17 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Folks, the above needs better sourcing to support notability per WP:CLUB. Anyone? – ukexpat (talk) 20:27, 30 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above suggests that you believe that the content within the article is sufficient for the club to be deemed notable, and just needs sourcing for verifiability. However, just to be clear, is this the extent of your concern, or do you think that the article content itself needs to be more indicative of the notability of the club?Kwib (talk) 08:51, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have made a change to this template to allow the entry of tries, conversions, penalties and drop goals separately as "tryX", "conX", "penX" and "dropX", where "X" can be either "1" or "2", 1 being the "home" team and 2 being the "away" team. A trial of the modifications has been rolled out at 2009 British and Irish Lions tour to South Africa so that you can see how it works. – PeeJay 12:49, 9 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe the union and league kids can get together and collaborate a new list as well as a new cat regarding league-2-union converts and vice versa..--Warpath (talk) 02:11, 11 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Isn't that covered within List of players who have converted from one football code to another? Has sections within for converts in both directions.--Bcp67 (talk) 20:43, 11 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting, but doesn't that page look a little bit messed up ? ..--Warpath (talk) 22:52, 11 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Also see Dual-code rugby internationals if you aren't aware of that page Mattlore (talk) 00:16, 17 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Aside from the dual internationalists, there are a number of converts who are single internationalists, or who have had notable careers without being capped.--MacRusgail (talk) 22:19, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Is it me or since Shudde left, people have stop paying attention to articles and WP:RU completely? ...--Warpath (talk) 20:41, 16 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Speak for yourself, I still see hard work going into many regions of rugby articles; just may not be your region of interest. Also I don't see how this statement moves us foreward. FruitMonkey (talk) 21:11, 16 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This used to be a busy section of WP:RU bu bad wikipolitics killed it ...--Warpath (talk) 21:37, 16 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with that statement; misdirection like the Irish flag debacle, I believe, has driven people away from the project. Though there are still quality articles being created and maintained. FruitMonkey (talk) 21:57, 16 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Largely, because of my experience on the Irish flag issue, I for one have given up on the whole section because of, what I see as, the small-minded intransigance of a tiny clique who police any changes to these pages; I do not see it as a rational, open-minded collaborative effort at all. . MukDen (talk) 13:29, 18 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If you've given up on the project because of an issue that we have absolutely no control over, then I think you need to take a good look at your decision-making process. Personally, I can't believe you would give up on the project just because we can't use one particular image! – PeeJay 15:08, 18 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There are still a number of people beavering away, a number of whom use this talk page. I've been trying to create articles on rugby heritage from all corners of the world, and have created one or two Scottish ones. (Although Scottish rugby isn't really receiving much attention on wikipedia unfortunately - especially considering we're the second oldest rugby nation!)

I didn't like the Ireland fiasco myself, since there were several viable all Ireland alternatives available...--MacRusgail (talk) 22:19, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'd like to open up a discussion which is going on around 1984 Australia rugby union tour of the British Isles and Ireland. This, and a number of other RU tours have been subject to multiple page name moves and I'm hoping that between us we could thrash out a policy for such tours to establish a definitive name which we can stick with.

Should it be "Britain and Ireland", which is my own preference, "British Isles" - politically controversial... "British Isles and Ireland", which doesn't seem to make a great deal of sense... or "something else"? Suggestions please!--Bcp67 (talk) 07:28, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not just the naming conventions for the countries, but the whole title should be discussed. I believe it should be YEAR / TOURING COUNTRY / rugby union tour of LIST OF TEST COUNTRIES PLAYED. Therefore if a tour takes in Canada, America, France, Ceylon, Zimbabwe as part of a larger tour, but no caps were awarded for the encounter, it is not named in the list. Also "Touring Country" is the actual name of the country and not the team's nickname. FruitMonkey (talk) 07:46, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I would go for "Britain and Ireland", as you say "British Isles" while technically correct could annoy some people. The "British Isles and Ireland" is just wrong. I would also endorse FruitMonkey's suggestion on the wider naming convention. noq (talk) 12:14, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not entirely happy with that, but certainly less clunky.--MacRusgail (talk) 22:19, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Came across a new article Harold Dingwall Bateson at first I thought it was a hoax as it said he played for Liverpool F.C. so I added speedy tag editor has now added source that he was capped for England could do with expert eyes. BigDunc 21:27, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, he was capped for England in 1879. Just the once, but he's valid.FruitMonkey (talk) 21:35, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thats great thanks. BigDunc 21:37, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'm going to try and push Arthur Gould (rugby player) for Good Article status. If anyone wants to give the article a quick look over, or better still knows of a photo that can be used would be appreciated. FruitMonkey (talk) 21:27, 24 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No idea on a photo I am afraid, but I'm willing to run a critical eye over the article and see how it stacks up against the GA criteria.--Bcp67 (talk) 17:07, 25 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have managed to add two images since initial statement. A team photo of Gould as captain would be welcome. FruitMonkey (talk) 19:46, 25 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Can I suggest that we should have an article on cross-code rugby? I have put some notes on the hybrid sports page, but it would be interesting to have some material on league-union games. I think these are probably more common than people realise, and took place during the wars in military set ups etc. --MacRusgail (talk) 18:25, 25 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Numerous people have, over the past few months, been working dilligently on the Pontypridd RFC wiki, trying to bring it up to scratch. We'd very much appreciate some solid feedback. Thanks so much. --Monkeynuts2008 (talk) 15:59, 3 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Can anyone offer some help? I don't know anything about notability requirements for rugby union teams. I declined the speedy deletion on this userpage, but I had to block the username per WP:ORGNAME. - Dank (push to talk) 12:43, 6 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have nominated List of 1888–1889 New Zealand Native football team matches for featured list removal here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets the featured list criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks; editors may declare to "Keep" or "Remove" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Dabomb87 (talk) 02:09, 18 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have nominated myself Template_talk:Did_you_know#1955_British_Lions_tour_to_South_Africa

Did you know that "... that a young Idi Amin was reserve for the East Africa rugby union team when they played the 1955 British Lions tour to South Africa?"

Bcp67 has told me my edit made him/her "sit up", and this encouraged me to put this up. I don't know how many unusual rugby facts we get on the front page, but I hope you will support this one for the "Did you know?" section.--MacRusgail (talk) 19:27, 24 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Definitely a him! Fruitmonkey gets a few facts on there from time to time. I'll give it my support.--Bcp67 (talk) 19:31, 24 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry guys, it will get rejected. To be accepted for a DYK, the article must either be created within the last 7 days or be expanded by 500% over the same length of time. FruitMonkey (talk) 19:35, 24 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Did wonder about that and have stuck a note on MacRusgail's talk page to that effect - the fact also appears in his newly created article on the East Africa rugby union team but I fear that might not be long enough to meet the criteria.--Bcp67 (talk) 19:39, 24 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Then that's our way in; I've got some books with info on the East African team, but not much. It should be enough to get accepted as a DYK though. I'll give it some attention tomorrow.FruitMonkey (talk) 20:36, 24 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

"Definitely a him!" - Sorry, no offence meant! --MacRusgail (talk) 01:50, 25 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

And none taken either!--Bcp67 (talk) 19:42, 25 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The East Africa rugby union team page is now over the 1,500 character minimum for a DYK, I did a bit of expansion of the material. So I may try and resubmit this under the EA article rather than the Lions one. I also suspect that EA may have played other games, but it is very hard to track them down. The article got created yesterday (2:45 am here and I must go to bed), so there's still six days to play with.

By the way, if anyone's interested in the unusual corners of rugby, someone's created this article - Rugby union at the 2009 Maccabiah Games. The Maccabiah are basically the Jewish Olympics (and are partly a political exercise to get people to settle in Israel - but let's not go there!), and the teams that enter are amateurs from the various countries, and not up to the standards of the "real" national teams, but something I wasn't aware of until this year.

I'm hoping this isn't the last rugby DYK I can get. I'm sure there's more. (The South Sea Islanders playing their first international with a tree in the middle of the pitch?) Guid publiceety fur the eggba' an aw that... Thanks for the support. --MacRusgail (talk) 01:43, 25 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

East Africa's on the front page today! Thanks for your help.--MacRusgail (talk) 14:43, 27 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Or so they claim.--MacRusgail (talk) 15:44, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

As you may know, we currently have 400 good article nominations, with a large number of them being in the sports and recreation section. As such, the waiting time for this is especially long, much longer than it should be. As a result of this, I am asking each sports-related WikiProject to review two or three of these nominations. If this is abided by, then the backlog should be cleared quite quickly. Some projects nominate a lot but don't review, or vice-versa, and following this should help to provide a balance and make the waiting time much smaller so that our articles can actually get reviewed! Wizardman 23:39, 5 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Is there a way to add a link to the source of the infomation found in players infoboxes? I'm thinking of something like the "|source=" field found in template:Infobox cricketer biography. Nev1 (talk) 17:12, 7 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I recently created an article on Angus Stuart, a little known Cardiff and Dewsbury player who toured with the British Isles team of 1888. On completion I found he linked to a New Zealand tour of 1893, and a list of New Zealand rugby union players. Does anyone have any information linking Angus Stuart from Cardiff to Angus Stuart the New Zealand player. They are surely the same person as Stuart settled in New Zealand after the tour, but I have no proof such as a date/place of birth or death to link the two together, and I don't want to enter information built on assumption. Cheers FruitMonkey (talk) 12:19, 13 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

• Scratch that, found my proof. FruitMonkey (talk) 12:56, 13 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've come across an article named The South (rugby) which describes the South district team which used to play against touring teams (and in the SRU district championship) in the amateur era. The title doesn't seem fully descriptive and I'm proposing to change it to something along the lines of South (Scottish rugby union team) or similar. Any thoughts from anyone?

The books I have that list the South Africa and New Zealand tours call this district side 'South of Scotland'. Is 'The South' a term used within Scotland to describe the team? FruitMonkey (talk) 18:59, 15 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

In the Rothmans Yearbooks they use the phrase South of Scotland for the tour matches but just South in the results and tables of the SRU district championship.--Bcp67 (talk) 19:26, 15 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I see that File:Irelands Flag.svg has started to show up on several articles. Is there consensus for that? I'm unclear whether that is close enough to the real IRFU flag to be a copyright violation or not. — Andrwsc (talk · contribs) 04:26, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The image is clearly based on the real IRFU flag and would probably be considered a copyright violation. There was no discussion about it here, and it should be deleted. – PeeJay 06:53, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Why is it impossible for me to edit individual sections on this page now? Is anyone else having this problem? – PeeJay 06:57, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've hit the same problem. FruitMonkey (talk) 15:02, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think we ought to ask someone at the helpdesk for help! – PeeJay 19:17, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've been picked up on a GA nominated article that I have used at different times all three spellings. Even the page Rugby union positions has used all three terms in different places. Could we come to a decision on the spellings as it will prevent updates further down the line. I'm going for 'full back' in the article as it appears to be the most common spelling in text books. While we are at it are there other positions that crop up with this problem, such as threequarter, three-quarter and three quarter. Cheers FruitMonkey (talk) 15:06, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'd say 'full back' is the most logical version and probably the most common too. And I can't edit sections either!--Bcp67 (talk) 16:35, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

But this BBC page says "full-back"... – PeeJay 19:17, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This is why it's a real problem. The RFU use full back in some pages while although only mentioned on the IRFU site on their Hall of fame they use fullback and full-back. Scrum.com use Fullback, but like PeeJay states, the BBC use full-back fairly constantly. I feel no closer to any option. FruitMonkey (talk) 19:56, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]